Sound of...Podcast
Highlighting Maryland's musical artist's that have played our showcases and beyond! Hosted by Stephen Harrod (AKA Scott of the Andes), we delve into the songwriters journey and intentions as to why they create. If you want to know about Maryland's local songwriters, this is the podcast for you! Be sure to catch one of our showcases going on throughout the year, happy listening!
Sound of...Podcast
Cam Mae-EP18
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I had a panic attack in the middle of the road. Rage Bull drivers told me to stop going so slow. And I guess I could have gone off to the side.
SPEAKER_04Hello everyone and welcome to the Sound of Podcast, a supplemental for Sound of Presents. If you haven't been to one of our showcases, what are you waiting for? Check it out. We got one coming up July 25th. The SummerSlam, Patio Plays Volume 2, with this particular person, Cam May. They're on the show. We talk all things music, songwriting, being vulnerable. It's all there. Sound of a podcast.
SPEAKER_00All I wanted was to stand in light. Take my time. But my body doesn't like to let me relax.
SPEAKER_04What's up, Cam?
SPEAKER_01Hi. The sky is what I should have said. Whoa. The sky is up. Got it.
SPEAKER_04You heard it first.
SPEAKER_01Your ceiling is up.
SPEAKER_04What what song were you listening to in the car when you got here?
SPEAKER_01My Iron Lung by Radio Head.
SPEAKER_04By Radio Head.
SPEAKER_01That was the last thing, yeah.
SPEAKER_04That song's cool.
SPEAKER_01It is dope. Is that the I have a playlist of every single song that I've because there's like liked songs on Spotify, but then specific ones that I really like, I add to a playlist called the One Playlist that rules them all. And I shuffle it. There's like over a hundred hours of songs on there. So I'm always like, Universe, what song should I listen to right now? And then that one played right before I arrived. I'm like, that's that's a good hype song. It's good.
SPEAKER_04You know what I do, which probably just shows whatever my neuroses are. I not only have playlists for sure, songs, great. Songs love them. I have playlists for seasons. I have playlists for morning. I have playlists for driving home from work for a while. Um, you know, your gym one. No, I I do love that stuff in terms of it customizing in that way.
SPEAKER_01I used to do that a lot, very specific playlists, and then recently I've only been doing like the one playlist that has them all, and then I make yearly playlists for every new song that I find that year, so which feels nice looking back and like, oh, these are all the songs I listened to in 2025, and it's a whole mood. I like that, and other than that, I'll just be listening to like one album that I'm obsessed with on repeat.
SPEAKER_04That I've gotten back into that lately because when I travel for work, it's about like 45 minutes, and that's mostly an album.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's cool.
SPEAKER_04Yeah. Cause it puts less of a kind of an owner, like, don't get me wrong, I loved DJ, I love my playlists, I love being like, and now I'm gonna do this song in that way. But then part of me is like, I just want to let an album play, and uh and we'll go on that journey and and then it's done, and I've experienced that, and I don't I don't know if everybody's, you know, in that same way. I I think it it trades off. Speaking of, do you remember the first album that you were like that you wanted to purchase or that you just kind of fell in love with and just was on repeat forever?
SPEAKER_01I mean, first album that I remember being obsessed with was probably either Twenty-Five by Adele or Reputation by Taylor Swift. Those were like my childhood middle school, really essential albums. It was I was obsessed with Adele a lot.
SPEAKER_04She's great, she's wonderful. Um for uh trivia fact, Dan Wilson of Semisonic Closing Time, he wrote, co-wrote uh anybody, what what is that song again? Sorry, I don't know what's he doing. He co-wrote that. Um He's an amazing songwriter.
SPEAKER_01That's so cool.
SPEAKER_04Yeah. So that was your those were your first couple. Do you remember when you started writing your own music?
SPEAKER_01Um, I remember when I was like 11, I went to a summer camp in New York. Um, French Woods summer camp.
SPEAKER_04Was that upstate?
SPEAKER_01Yes. Alright. It was like my parents' phrases like this is like a big deal. This is a big expensive camp. You're only going once, you better enjoy it, like that kind of thing. And it was really cool because it was almost like school in a way, where like it was structured in blocks and you pick your schedule every day, what you wanted to do. And that's where I learned to play guitar, and that is where I took my first song right in class, and I think wrote my first song. And that's where it started.
SPEAKER_04Do you remember how did do you remember how they taught you in that way, or what did they what was the uh syllabus? Tell me the syllabus.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, guitar-wise, we all just learned we started by learning pumped-up kicks on guitar, just like a four-chord song. I don't yeah. Um, and then after that, it was like, okay, pick what song you want to learn today, and I will find the chords for you and help you learn it. Um, songwriting-wise, that one was not a very popular class. So, like, I have no clue. But most of the time it was just me and the instructor, which was honestly kind of really fun. But he would literally, we'd be sitting on the grass, and also that class was right after guitar class, so I would just take the guitar from the guitar class and bring it to songwriting class, and we'd sit on the grass, and he'd be like, Look around, what do you want to write about today? And it was just really cool. It was a really nice just I don't know, exercise, I guess.
SPEAKER_04No, that's so amazing that they given the space within that, and you're probably in the right it's kind of the thing that I hear about when people go to song retreats. And and I want to go. I mean, I don't know how they work. You write, you hang out somewhere in the in a rural area and you write stuff.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Yeah. I'd I want to do one of those, but I always feel like it really is a circumstantial type of thing of that you're in the right space to kind of do all of that. Had you but you had had an interest in that earlier on?
SPEAKER_01I mean, yeah, my sister, um, who's in Leo Insignus, I watched their band my whole childhood. I fell asleep to their CD playing, stuff like that. Like I was there for band practices. So like music was always there, and I think I always knew like if I got into it, like I'd have so many like supporting people to help me. Um So yeah, it was it was always an interest, and I think that camp was just a like a really good way to start, and I was obsessed after that.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, I think it's kind of the it's an ultimate addiction in some ways of once you kind of crack out your first song. Well, you either kind of get embarrassed by it and you bury it in that way, or or you kind of keep going and you keep building.
SPEAKER_01I know a recording of that first song still exists and it haunts me to this day.
SPEAKER_04Is it on the the internet? Daniel has it.
SPEAKER_01Daniel Alraz, he has it on his Google Drive. It's in a vault. Every so often he sends a link to me, and I'm like, no, you can't. No, we can leave this behind.
SPEAKER_04Oh, does he want to update it or record it?
SPEAKER_01It's ridiculous it's called Little Johnny Trash Can. It's like just a stupid, silly song. It's more like, look at this nostalgic thing of you at like 12 years old playing this song in front of your grandparents for the first time. It's just a really cute memory.
SPEAKER_04But um, I'm already hooked from the title alone, so I'd like you to elaborate right now on this. And I'm sorry if this is embarrassing, but the name of the song is Little Johnny Come On.
SPEAKER_01Little Johnny Trash Can. Again, like the instructor was like, look around, what do you want to write about? And I said, trash can. And then we wrote we wrote a song, named him Little Johnny Trash Can. He's only three feet tall, but he's the best trash can of them all. And I quote, Dang. It's a good song.
SPEAKER_04How long is it? Does it have like a bridge and like a whole thing? It's a minute and a half. Oh, it's a minute? Hey, short and sweet, right?
SPEAKER_01There's like two verses in a chorus.
SPEAKER_04What's the second verse?
SPEAKER_01God knows if I remember.
SPEAKER_04You gotta dust it off. I know. You gotta open it out again.
SPEAKER_01But like I said, there's a video. I could watch it. I choose not to. One day. One day I'm sure we'll bring it out of the vault.
SPEAKER_04The cam vault. Yes. For subscribers only here the Patreon.
SPEAKER_01I don't have a Patreon, but it's I don't know.
SPEAKER_04It's a means to it. Or I don't know if you have that much engagement. I guess it's you can do it, but yeah, I don't know. It's it depends how you want to monetize these things. So you went from so how does one go from little Johnny Trash can to panic attack?
SPEAKER_01Um Um high school? High school. High school.
SPEAKER_04Uh you abandon Nerdo in high school or not really. Just kind of hung out.
SPEAKER_01What I've realized is, you know, at first it started with like 12-year-old imagination brain writing about whatever. And at some point there was a switch in like super like mental health-related writing. And what I've come to realize, because I do not write as much as I used to, I was writing songs like every day when I was 13 or something. But what I've had to kind of understand is that at some point writing became a coping mechanism, which was great, and it really helped me through some really hard times, and now I'm in a place where I feel like safe and secure and happy, and I'm not writing as much. And that's okay. And I am writing, I'm and I'm finding more creative outlets, but like I don't know, it's just a I think a different relationship now than it was. But yeah, the majority of the the album that I'm working on was written like freshman sophomore year of high school, which is a very upending time of life, I feel like. So I think you can feel the youngness in a lot of the songs.
SPEAKER_04And that's not a bad thing, just you know, is it weird to go back and revisit kind of those particular emotions? Because it it probably it's not the same, right? I mean it doesn't feel the same you now versus you then.
SPEAKER_01It is odd because it's also like Daniel and I have been working on this for so long that we keep hitting waves of like, wow, I'm bored of this song, and then we change it. And like multiple songs on the album, we had a track, and I was like, I don't like this anymore. Can we completely redo it? And then we did it, and now I like it. Like it it just takes a little bit of revamping sometimes, because while it's kind of hard how long it's taken, um, it's also kind of nice because Daniel and I are constantly improving. So like the songs are way better than what they started as. So I don't know, it's kind of nice.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, in that writing process, I guess where where do you obviously drawing from personal experiences, but then I mean, how far along do you get with these songs? Like, are they mostly done? And then you're just like, no, let's tear this down and start over. Or at what point are you like, this isn't working?
SPEAKER_01It's mostly musically things that don't work. Like lyrically, I'm a very like one and done writer, which is some talking to other songwriters has been so cool hearing everyone writes different, and I think that's really cool. But I how it used to be it's changed as of recently, but at least during this period of writing the album, it was very much like I sit down, I write a song in 30 minutes, it's done. That's it. I don't change the words, it's done. And and it and and then we record it, usually very close, because I would I would come to Daniel, who is my producer, and be like, hey, I wrote this song, let's record it. Let's do it. And then we recorded it. And obviously with a song that's super fresh, it's gonna have a fresh feeling, if that makes sense.
SPEAKER_04Like well, it's new, the iron is hot, etc.
SPEAKER_01And then you're gonna come back to it a while later and be like, actually this can be better, you know? Like the fresh ideas are great, and I love having the ability to get them down immediately because uh there's something about that that you can't repeat, but then there's other stuff that like once you like once you brew, brew on it, it becomes better and you have better ideas. So it's a mix.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, it's a fine line. I sometimes feel like stagnanted, um not in writing, but like more, I guess, from like the song's perspective of if most of it is recorded, then it becomes this thing of like I have to release this, like ASAP, because if I don't, then it's never gonna get done. And and that's on me. I'm like my way of self-producing it. Like, I have nobody to blame but myself in that in that regard. Um, sometimes having a second set of years helps, but then other times I'm like, you know, yeah, this is done, this is ready to go, let's let's put it out there in that way. Because I have this, I don't know, it's just this nagging feeling of like if you just sit on stuff long enough, no matter how many revisions you do to it or whatever, it's just like, is is this gonna come out or when am I gonna feel comfortable enough for this to you know push in its space? Do you remember when you were first starting to to perform live out to people and in that experience? Was that scary?
SPEAKER_01Yes. Yes. Um I was around 15, which is that's young.
SPEAKER_04Performance age too much.
SPEAKER_01Super, super stage right, super duper stage right. Again, having my sister and Daniel in their band, once I started showing interest, they were very much like, come play with us, come sit, like we have a show, come sing one song with us. And I remember them having a show at some restaurant, bar, whatever, and I was there with my parents, and then my sister was like, Cam, will you join me for this? Like on the microphone, like, Cam, come up and join me for this song. And it was a song that my sister and I like sang and played together all the time, like throughout my childhood. It was a song I knew and loved, and I was so nervous. And I walked up and then I started crying and ran away. And funny enough, I know that there is a clip of this exact moment on Facebook. Like some random person at the restaurant was like, look at this cool band, and filming a video, and happened to catch the exact moment where I ran off. That's like my first memory.
SPEAKER_04Nowhere to go but up.
SPEAKER_01But a while after that, Daniel had kept nagging me to go to the Cult Classic open mic, because it's a it's a great open mic. It is, and I wasn't going to, and then last minute the night that the open mic was happening, I was like, I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna do it. I don't know why, I don't know what flipped in my brain, but I wanted to, and I did it, and it was really fun. And Daniel and Daphne Ekman were there, and everyone was just super cool and supportive. That's that's my first memory of performing.
SPEAKER_04Those are the best ones in that way, and I think to speak to kind of the the support system that you had, I think that's also extremely important. Cause I think about I I guess what what pushed me forward into being like a theater kid, and that all actually comes back to my brother. When I saw my brother, my older brother, doing like high school plays and stuff, I was like, well, hang on a minute, if he can do that, then like why can't I? And it's kind of almost like a permission thing of you see your peers doing it and you're like, I want to do that, and then also like if you have somebody that's close to you in that way doing it, and they're you know, they didn't come out, you know, crying or or they're not, you know, they didn't fall face first on the stage or whatever. Like, if it's okay for them to do it, then why can't I?
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_04And it's it's so it's almost like a permission or or kind of like a the gate opens in that way of like, oh, this is for this is for everybody, or if they're doing it, then then so can I. And I think it's tremendously important.
SPEAKER_01It definitely I would not be anywhere near where I am without those people in the beginning. Like Daniel, Nicole, and and Daphne really helped in the beginning. It was it was really nice. And like seeing these people that I love the music that they're making and the way that they sound and the things that they're doing, and having them tell me that they love what I'm making is like that's like a drug hearing that honestly, because uh, you know, I think there's a little bit of imposter syndrome in everybody, probably, but getting compliments from the people that you look up to is like a crazy feeling that I think really helped me feel okay at what I'm doing.
SPEAKER_04It's the best feeling in the world, and I think it goes through I think I saw like a prompt. I know that the the instranet and all of that, I think does it a lot, or at least algorithmically it knows what's up for me. And you know, it'll it'll send me stuff of people talking about why are you simping for billionaires or or whomever namestar who doesn't know you exist when you can be lifting up and supporting your friends in a way, whether that's the reshare or or helping out in that way. And for a while for me, at least when I uh lived abroad, I was really nervous to try to talk to people about that because I didn't think that they wanted anything to do with that. But I think because we're all lovers of music um and song and crafting, uh if you're in that right community, we all kind of go out of the way for each other, um, which is you know incredibly uh humbling, really, because I I think sometimes we can kind of silo ourselves away, but if you have people around you that are supporting you and what you're doing and and are vibing off of you in that same way, it's um it's contagious. And you know, I push back at at the ID, uh the ideology of like I don't know if you've heard that term um of passing around the same 20 bucks or whatever. Yeah. In terms of the and you know what? I I don't care. Like I if um It's more fun than life. Exactly, yeah. Honestly. I mean I I would rather be in a space that is just overly welcoming to whatever we're putting out there than just a certain amount of apathy that goes with it. Where do you think um you'd want to go further as a as a songwriter? I mean, it seems like you are constantly, you know, moving pieces in and around. It sounds like you're the the train uh with tracks getting built in front of it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. I keep feeling a sense of stagnation and in my writing and just wanting something different. I know in the past year my like musical influences have I've I've added a lot to like I've been listening to a lot more like Radiohead, Muse, like that kind of stuff, and then also I've been listening to some like weird time signature art rock type stuff too. So I honestly just want to get weirder. That's my goal right now is to get weirder and different. And I'm at a point where I don't really care if what I write ever comes to light or if it's good. I know it will be eventually, but like the goal right now is different, not great.
SPEAKER_04That's a sweet goal, actually. And well, and in terms of like good, who's to say? I'm to say with that.
SPEAKER_01You know what flips my subconscious?
SPEAKER_04Well, yeah, if it's according to your subconscious, then then I you know that's a never ending artistic fight. Um but it's it's also the thing of who was it? I d I saw like a little interview with what's his face? Jesse Wells? Is that who it is? The guy that does a lot of the political stuff in that way. And he just talked about what I think all songwriters know, which is like it's your North Star is you in a way. And you just need to believe in what you're doing, and that it's reflective of that feeling and emotion that you're trying to convey. I mean, sure, there's always gonna be a place for the the pop hits and like the stuff that you can, you know, shovel down people's throats that's that's easy and accessible, and nothing wrong with that. There's there's always a place for that, but um there's something about the earnestness within that too that I think is kind of always attracted me in songwriting. Um because then otherwise, what are you doing? You're tracing trends, you're I don't know. And I understand it's that balance of like you want to feel validated as an artist, as an individual, but it's also like you don't want to make stuff that doesn't resonate with you. Yeah. Like would you, you know, buy whatever from that? I don't know.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. I think one thing that I've been um realizing too is I've carried a little bit of fear from like past relationships in honesty. And like I've been told that the songs I'm writing are not honest, which feels like such a strange criticism.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, that's well, they'd really have to be listening. Where's where are they getting that?
SPEAKER_01Creativity. And in my experience, it's all feelings. I don't think songs are about facts, I think they're about feelings.
SPEAKER_04Well, sometimes well, sorry to correct you, but Johnny Trash can. That was a fact song, right?
SPEAKER_01That's true, that was totally a fact song. But um, yeah, so I think I'm just trying to be led more by um feelings.
SPEAKER_04Yeah. Yeah, I think that's the basis for it. Or it can be, yeah, a descriptive thing in that way, but sometimes yeah, you have to lead with that. Because if not, then then what are we doing? I don't know. And and I think people's brain processes that in a different way. Like if you want to do like a a club hit or whatever, you want to get a song that has people dancing, sure, you can do that. Um you can also make it earnest in that way of kind of the the truthful aspects of it as well. So you you've played out um how long have you been playing out? A bit, right?
SPEAKER_01Like four or five years, yeah.
SPEAKER_04What do you what would you say to yourself of like, or what would you say to that 15-year-old self that ran away now at this at this vantage point?
SPEAKER_01Um I don't know, man. I don't think I'd say anything. Is that a hot take?
SPEAKER_04No. You just stare at yourself and be like, it's chill.
SPEAKER_01I don't think that there's anything that I could say to pass me that would change what's happened, if that makes sense. Like I think that there's like a path and that I was supposed to take, and I'm here. Like, you know what I mean? Like, maybe just it's okay. Don't hate yourself. That's it. Be kind to yourself and others.
SPEAKER_04It's super big, yeah, in that way.
SPEAKER_01I don't know.
SPEAKER_04Have there been any standout shows that you've played kind of in the last uh you know, couple of years where I guess again, juxtaposing you at 15 like one day you're gonna be playing.
SPEAKER_01Well, I know the first like quote unquote real show that I played after that open mic, I I opened for Daphne Ekman at 49 West. I think I'll forever remember it. It was so fun. She sang with me on a song, and like we Daniel recorded everything, so we have that whole set forever. And that was I think the first time I felt the real like high of people liking and like clapping to your music. Um I had a super amazing experience at a a sofar show. You know what so far shows are? Basically, um people sign they people buy tickets to a sofar show. You don't know the location until 24 hours before. You have no clue who's playing until you get there. So it's literally just people who want to hear music. They don't care what. They just want to have a fun time and hear new music. And I love that idea. I always have. So I played a bunch of those. Um where were they? All over. I there's shows in Baltimore and there's shows in DC, and and there's way more, but those are the ones that I've played. I've played at a bunch of venues that I have no memory of because Daniel's the one who drives. Oh. So it's okay. I'm like, I don't care where we're going, you're driving. Um, but there was one very special night. I think it was like an LGBT night two or something, um, where all all of the performers were were queer. And just the audience was so receptive to everything I had to say and sing. And it was like a like a beautiful feeling. It's hard to replicate. Because like it's really nice playing in Annapolis with all the people that I know and all the friends, but it's also a completely different experience to play to a room of complete strangers and still feel like I'm being heard, you know.
SPEAKER_04And there's yeah, no, a hundred percent. And there's a lot of apprehension that can kind of come with that too, because you're like, are they gonna like it?
SPEAKER_01You don't know, sometimes it doesn't go well, and sometimes it does.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, yeah, it's super important, I think, to be in those kind of validating spaces. And you know, I I think there's a lot of well, gig's a gig and you play where you play, and you know, I I honestly don't subscribe to that. Like the older I get to a degree. I mean, if you're getting paid to play wherever, great, fine, but I feel like there's a misinterpretation in modern music these days of like, well, Bruce Springsteen was playing in a bar for five years, and then he became and I'm like, I don't but it's not that anymore. Yeah. You know? Like it's um I think people's attention is divided between their their phones or or if the game's on or whatever, despite the space, and that's that's why I kind of champion these other areas that it it more is specifically for music and kind of these pop-up shows that you're talking about.
SPEAKER_01I've really had the luxury of I do very few like bar kicks. And they're they're fun. Like I do actually like them. Um, and I've heard from a lot of other artists that it gets really tiring being the band in the corner that no one's paying attention to. I kind of like it because I I have an anxiety about performing. Like I do like it, but I'm always anxious. I'm always anxious, I think I always will be. That's how it is. So it's kind it's kind of nice just being like, all I have to do is sing, and it does they're not really looking at me, that's okay. But but I have also had the luxury of playing very few of those and playing a lot of really fun shows with my friends in listening spaces, and it's you can't compare it, you know?
SPEAKER_04Yeah, and and I think it's this mutual kind of respect thing, and I think, you know, depending on the space, that can be uh I think more accommodating, and then sometimes not, and then you you play it in that way too. But I know for me personally, and I got spoiled with Los Angeles listening rooms too, um, but that that was kind of my you know, that's that's your peak in that way, and I don't know to subject oneself to anything other than that. It's like why? But I guess it's kind of the thing that I don't know, even film directors talk about and stuff, they're like, Well, I'll make one movie for the studio and then I'll make one movie that's for me. And and maybe it kind of gets replicated with the musicians of well, this gig is, you know, could lead to that, or there's that other conversation of a gig versus a show.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
SPEAKER_04You know words.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Well, the gig is like, you know, here's a couple of bucks you play, whatever, and then the show's like, well, the money might not be there, but just the kind of environment you're in is so nurturing in in and of that way. Where do you think you would want to um play that that you haven't? I guess city-wise? Is there a special place where you're like, man, that'd be cool. I want to go there.
SPEAKER_01Maybe this sounds a bit weird or bad, but I don't really have too many goals when it comes to the playing and music because I don't know. I know that when the album comes out eventually, I do want to do like a little tour or something. I want to experience it. It sounds fun. And I did have a trip to Nashville last year, which was really fun, and I got to I got to play in Nashville. That was a cool experience that I didn't think would happen so soon. But I don't know. I like the small venues, I like the friends.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, talk about Nashville. Uh what what brought that on? What was what was the call? Paint me the picture. They said Cam, Nashville's calling. Come on in.
SPEAKER_01We had a friend who already had some shows lined up in Nashville, and then my other friend David, um, David Augustus, also had that show in Nashville, like the same exact show. They just happened to be put on the same show. And then we're like, well, let's get an Airbnb together. And then I Daniel and David and and and the other friend all went, and then I was invited just because um, and then I got put on the same shows as well. So it was really fun, it was interesting. Cool like it. So much country music there.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, they love it. It's no Tino Shade.
SPEAKER_01It was cool, but I am very different from the music that was the majority of music played there. It very much was like, oh, I'm not from here. Like, obviously, I'm not, but was that apparent though?
SPEAKER_04I mean, or did it okay? I mean because I wonder about I haven't been. I mean, I know people that have gone, etc., but like, is it like you're on the different planet there in some ways?
SPEAKER_01But like everyone has accents, and like even on on the way there, we had a uh trouble with David's truck, and we ended up having to pull over because the the tire was coming off. The bolts were not screwed, which is very bad, by the way. That was yeah, really dangerous. Luckily, we caught it. Um, but there was a guy there because we stopped at like a gas station, and there was a guy there, and we were almost there by that point, like maybe an hour or two out. So we were in this in the more country side, and there was a guy there, and he was helping us out and letting us borrow some tools from his truck, and he gave them a handshake shake, and then went to me and was like, This is my handshake for ladies, and gave me a hug. And I was like, Okay, right? Never happened to me in Maryland. Um, just just silly things like that. There's there's just a slightly different way about it.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_01The way they talk and and behave.
SPEAKER_04Was it which is cool. Yeah. Was it different in terms of how they were talking about music and and stuff like that? I mean, because I know it's it's a far more career-based thing there. Like people are, you know, shaking trees and and hoping for I guess whatever their di definition of success is in that way. Was that apparent?
SPEAKER_01Or not super like it definitely felt more hungry, if that makes sense. Like I feel like obviously obviously this isn't a hundred percent everyone, but at least my experience here in like the Annapolis music scene is like most people are here for fun. Like, obviously, I think we all want something from and hope for things, and but um and maybe this is just my perception and my experience, but like I'm here for a good time. I'm here for a good time. And then I think a lot of people over there were very hungry for more, which makes sense. And and it's a cool passion that like like I feel passion too, but in in a different way, you know what I mean?
SPEAKER_04The motivation's different, yeah. Yeah. Um when Bernsey was on here a while back, she said something that that I kind of think of, which is not not comparing Maryland with Nashville, but with Maryland, nobody's really there isn't that extra pressure of nobody thinks of Maryland as music city in the same way that any, you know, any Nashville or or Los Angeles or Austin is. And I think that kind of takes the pressure off it so people can be what they want to be and be in it for a good time. Um rather than what what's my next move? How do I get you know the record labels paid attention in that way, even though who the fuck gets on record labels anymore? I don't think that's not how it happens.
SPEAKER_01Not really.
SPEAKER_04I think viral. Yeah. If you get a song on your TikTok, then then the money comes in, all the internet money, I guess, are how it works. I I don't fully understand it. I don't wrap my head around it in that way. I I I mean, I remember talking to people from the early 2000s if they were doing the record deal thing and they were they were well on their way, and then kind of the politics gets, you know, uh shows up in the way it does, and then it, you know, it kind of falls apart in that way. Yeah, I have I have no idea what that looks like now.
SPEAKER_01I just they keep telling me I need to social media, but I don't social media very well.
SPEAKER_04Why?
SPEAKER_01Oh god, it makes me so anxious. Yeah. I don't like I don't like posting. I don't like posting, I don't like texting, I don't like anything on my phone really, and it's kind of sucks that I chose a thing that it it's kind of required for.
SPEAKER_04Well, now it is. I felt like it didn't used to well before it was, you know, you had your flyers, or it was and I didn't even know. We still do the flyers.
SPEAKER_01Well, yeah, the flyers do flyers for my shows.
SPEAKER_04But and they're awesome, but it was like, you know, it's kind of like you would see in the 80s or even the 90s, people you'd have your street team and they'd like put them out on the cars and stuff like that. Um it's different now, yeah, in terms of the way that you you put it out there in that.
SPEAKER_01I don't know. I'm still trying to I know I need to do more, but I'm also trying to still have a healthy relationship with like Instagram and stuff. Oh, totally. So it's it's a it's a balance for sure that I have not mastered. But working on it.
SPEAKER_04I don't think anybody has, to be honest. I mean, like now it's gotten to the point where I have to limit my time on it. Um which is hard because in some ways it's like how are you supposed to um engage in in your buddy's stuff?
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_04But then also not get into just the unfettered slop that other people are throwing in that way.
SPEAKER_01I've had Instagram notifications silenced for like two years now, and I actually had to turn them back on because I've realized like I don't check my music Instagram account enough, so I'm not answering DMs. I'm accidentally leaving people undelivered for days. Yeah.
SPEAKER_04So And if they're giving you and if they're like, hey, want to play a show or whatever.
SPEAKER_01Hey, I want to be on a podcast. Um so I had I turned notifications for messages back on, and that was my like, I don't want to know who's liked anything, I don't want to know who's viewed anything or posted anything, but I do need to see when people message me. That's kind of important. So fingers crossed, I'll get better.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, I mean, sure, but it's also like it can wait in that way. I mean, if I really wanted to get in touch with you immediately, I guess I could have talked to Daniel. Daniel could have given me your info and in that way too. No, but I understand it's like a that's like a Chinese finger trap or something. Is that PC? Is that what they call those still? You know what I'm talking about?
SPEAKER_01I know what you're talking about. I yes. That was in my childhood.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Anyone younger than me, who knows?
SPEAKER_04It's still a thing. You know what's great for anxiety though? We've switched. This isn't about music anymore. We're just gonna talk about anxiety. Sounds good. Have you tried the it's a fidget thing that's it's kind of like the finger trap, but it's the it's the marble. You know that one? Like it's like a little mesh thing, and there's a marble in it, and you can just play with it.
SPEAKER_01That was never my favorite.
SPEAKER_04I love that one.
SPEAKER_01Because I use I use fidget toys a lot in high school because anxiety. Um, that was never my favorite, but I had one.
SPEAKER_04What's your favorite? Uh is it the traditional fidget spinner?
SPEAKER_01No. Oh no, I didn't use those were banned.
SPEAKER_04They were? Yes. Oh yeah.
SPEAKER_01Immediately got banned. Teachers would not put up with that.
SPEAKER_04I guess, but what harm is it doing? You're just spinning it.
SPEAKER_01I mean, people I think are flicking it on people and getting distracted. And and it became it wasn't just a fidget toy anymore for people who needed it. It was just popular for everyone. But I always loved I had like a like a six-sided cube with different things on each side. Like there was like a a flip side and the button side and oh yeah, I think I've seen those.
SPEAKER_04Um those are solid and the rubber kind of bass things too.
SPEAKER_01Like a texture-y one. Yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Um the ones that I get thrown off by, they got like the goop in them, like it's like squishy or whatever. But I don't know if you do this, I do this. I just want to get at the goop. I just want to fucking break the thing and be like, I broke it, now I can't use this anymore. Yeah. So I was like, this is pointless. This is a waste of money for me to just effectively this isn't helping with my anxiety. So I go with the squishy things better. Um not sure if that's any better, like toxicity-wise or whatever.
SPEAKER_01We all got plastic in us. It's okay.
SPEAKER_03It's true.
SPEAKER_01We're all gonna get cancer. It's okay. I've accepted it.
SPEAKER_03It's everywhere. Hooray. We're plastic people.
SPEAKER_01We are. There is a percentage of plastic in all of us. Yeah. That unites us all.
SPEAKER_04In that same way, like water, but like words. There was a band I saw that had a song called Microplastics. Yeah. It was really good. I think Dan, I forget what what their name was. I saw it at a Joe Martin show, but yeah, whole song was about microplastics.
SPEAKER_01Love it.
SPEAKER_04What song do you want to write that you think has yet to be written about?
unknownOh god.
SPEAKER_04You already got the trash can. There's only so many songs about a trash can.
SPEAKER_01Oh, what's something up in the world?
SPEAKER_04Or where does your inspiration strike you?
SPEAKER_01If it's not a feeling-based thing, do you have other elements of inspiration that you I literally just make shit up most of the time right now? It's either that or like deeply like trauma events. Like there are certain things in my life that I really would like to write about, but literally like can't. And it honestly in some ways it's like a wall that I want to break so bad. Like the fact that I can't write about it makes me want to write about it.
SPEAKER_04Well, who's saying like you just it just doesn't like happen.
SPEAKER_01I don't know. There's like a part like my brain is very like either like I'm writing or I'm not writing, and it's not a mood that I choose. It's yeah, I don't know. But like this is not unique, but I've always I wanted to write about I got into a car accident last year, and that was like a deeply like mind changing event. And that's something I wanted to write about and how how it feels.
SPEAKER_04Which is not a happy thing, but it's not, but I mean that's as we've learned, like. These are processing things that we all have to do.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_04And I think putting it to a melody or putting words in that way, it helps. Um and that's why I think it it can be addressed sometimes better in a song.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_04I mean, and that's the thing that I'd heard too, is that I think with creative people, songwriters, etc., it's sometimes we we don't have the words to process that in that way. So we have to kinda dress it up in that way. There's a song that I've been sitting on for a bit, not even sitting on, but but writing down um a family dog passed away. And we've had many, you know, dogs pass away uh in our time as a family and all, but this one was different, I think, just because that kind of stuff is it changes as you get older. You know, your understanding of um death and loss changes. And I've I've written stuff down because I want to talk about it, because um this dog was it was my brother's dog, but we would look after and stuff like that. Um but I know that I want to put it in a song in some way because it's a way of honoring her memory and just how much I miss her, and also just from that from the vantage point in that way. But I know what you mean in terms of like the struggle of you know, where do you start with that?
SPEAKER_00I don't know.
SPEAKER_04And it's it is, I think, like an a place of honesty and and earnestness in that way too.
SPEAKER_01I'm just under the belief that I need to stop forcing things. So like that's how I feel about most things right now. Like I I had been searching for uh trying to think of an idea for a tattoo, like memorial tattoo of my cat who's no longer with me. And I kept like just trying to think, like, man, I don't know what's gonna fit. And I I've always known like one day you're gonna know. One day you're gonna know. That's gonna be the day you know. I've had the day I know now, and now I have a plan for that tattoo. But I feel the same way about songs, like I there are things that I know I want to express at some point, and if I'm not ready, I'm not ready. And one day it's gonna happen, and I'll be ready.
SPEAKER_04Yeah. Yeah, and and that's the I think that's the key kind of thing, and that you can't put a rush on it in that way. It it's gonna get it's gonna introduce itself in that way, or it's gonna blindside you on what is it, some idle Tuesday or whatever they say. Um and then you go with that, and then you put it down, and um, and then it exists in that way. But no, you're a hundred percent right in terms of forcing, because there's a lot of things that I've you know, uh the EP that I've been working on, one of them I want to kind of finish it off with like a I don't know, like a punky kind of song. Or you're MCR, you like MCR?
SPEAKER_01I had a lot of friends who liked MCR. Yeah, so I so I yeah, I've heard some stuff.
SPEAKER_04I I basically need a song that's kind of like that song at the end of Danger Days, Vampire Money. I need a song like that. And I've already kind of pegged it in my head that that needs to be that song, but that's all I have. Yeah. I don't have a melody. I don't have I mean I have some words, but like I have no fucking idea. You know?
SPEAKER_01I have faith it will happen.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, we'll we'll we'll see.
SPEAKER_01I also find too that like I feel the most creative after watching a musician, like who's not me, obviously. Like, I saw two super like life life changing sounds so dramatic, but like low-key, but low-key, like brain-changing concerts. I saw Becca Stevens, who's one of my favorites, and it was so like it was like a small venue. I got to meet her and like hug her after. It was crazy. Like after that, watching the way her hands move, playing guitar.
SPEAKER_04Oh, you do that too?
SPEAKER_01Insane. She's such a good guitarist and lyricist, and the feelings I felt, I didn't know I was able to experience. And after that, I was so motivated to play guitar and get better and like make new things. And same thing I saw Madison Cunningham recently. Same thing. Her I don't understand how her hands move like that. And it's really inspired me of like learning what tunings she plays her songs in, and and learning her songs will influence the songs that I make now. You know what I mean? So uh, hey, learn how to play some MCR songs, and then your brain will intuitively write like that. Hopefully. Is kind of what happens.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, or it's like the the onion analogy, you know, if you eat enough onions, you just start to smell like it. It's like that, but yeah, with pulling from influences. Yeah, I get that. Well, Cam, as we're reaching our time here, I pose the question to you, or really, if somebody is just looking to get started into music, um, writing songs, what what would you say to them?
SPEAKER_01Um I mean this line has already been taken, but just do it. Just do it. I truly believe, like, if you want to do something, there is nothing that can stop you. Like the only thing stopping you is is you being like, I wanna do it, but if there's a but at the end of the sentence, remove it. Remove it, just do it. I the way it started for me, I was at a camp and I loved it, and I went home and I played guitar every day until I got better. That's just how it goes. You just have to do it and practice, and that's it. You'll get there.
SPEAKER_04Awesome. Thank you, Cam.
SPEAKER_01Thank you.
SPEAKER_00And it would be nice if people try to see where I was coming from, but they don't. They sit and stare at their phones.
SPEAKER_04Thanks so much for listening. You can follow us on Instagram for show announcements and other episodes. And if you dig the artist stuff, give them a follow. Give them a like. And if you want to go the extra mile, check them out at one of their shows, buy their merch, keep the scene alive. And I'll see you out there. Take care.